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Post time 2021-2-2 02:18 AM | Show all posts
Anand replied at 2021-2-2 01:16 AM
FYI, I am playing in Indian server

Meta is not about roles. It refers to Most Effective Tactics Av ...

Let's imagine. Layla deal 1400 damage. 
Mia deal 1000 damage by 5 targets with every shot. And summary deal 1000*5 = 5000 damage. 
Who win teamfight? Team where MM deal 1400/sec or team where MM deal 5000/sec? 

And strategy. Its not this ease. If you want to know theory, perfect strategy doesn't exist. You have 3 paths to play.

Split-push, teamfight and poke. 
 
They work like Rock Paper Scissors

Split push > teamfight > poke > split push.

As i see, you know only about teamfight composition and way to win. But even if we told about it - its not just about damage. Its about aoe damage, break in and CC. Depends on it - you must dash, stun most opponent and aoe them out. 

Not the all of the mages have good aoe CC and break in. Its why you must have good tank and fighter. 
And yep - Vale can't it, because he has no dash. 
In this way, some MM like Claude better than mages, even in midgame. 

And yep. Its a tip of the iceberg.
Post time 2021-2-2 08:29 AM | Show all posts
Magnum_bangbang replied at 2021-2-2 02:18 AM
Let's imagine. Layla deal 1400 damage. 
Mia deal 1000 damage by 5 targets with every shot. And su ...

Miya cannot deal damage to 5 targets. She can deal damage to max 3 targets within range and only one of them takes 1000 damage and the remaining two takes around 350 damage

Miya has attack speed boost but she will lose 70 percentage hp before entering the range to attack Layla and dies when she enter the attacking range. That's miya dies before getting a chance to attack Layla

It all depends upon battle situation

Also I know about split pushing strategy. I am a masha player and carried my team to victory many times only by pushing

I am not a specialist in poking but I do poke while playing Lesley

I said mages are a part of meta (most effective strategy). It means the strategy involves other role heroes too but not effective without mages

I never said mages can solo and dominate the game

I haven't played much with Claude so no comments about him. But I strongly disagree your point that Claude is better than mages

You are probably thinking about less effective mages. Maybe mage players are not that good in your server. Mages are dominating in India. Vale is in ban list here but you are rejecting him because he doesn't have flicker or dash skills
Post time 2021-2-2 09:49 AM | Show all posts
I am a mage/marksman player and when my team picks a mage and marksman, I pick Diggie. Diggie is a great hero to use. But using Diggie was great even with no tank in team, we still won. I have to say that it was great because my team said GG when no one picked tank and it looks like I proved them wrong that it was not GG.
Post time 2021-2-2 08:31 PM | Show all posts
Anand replied at 2021-2-2 08:29 AM
Miya cannot deal damage to 5 targets. She can deal damage to max 3 targets within range and only o ...

Maybe, but Irithel can. Anyway it still not about damage only. All heroes have up-side and down-side. 

So, you mean team with 1 mage is mage meta? Its sounds oddly. For sure you need someone with magic damage, because if you didnt opponents just buy a physical item defense and easily kill you. But its not make meta mage. 

And mate. I have mage on every game. Time to time i play mage too. Some time they carry team. Some time team carry them. They will have well balanced. Is only mage as i hate is Zhask. I am pretty sure is he OP one. But i can tell same about you - maybe your server haunt good assassins? On my server, some of them has a 80+% winrate. For sure normaly bans for my server is Helcart and Natalia. 

Anyway, if you still think so, i can invite you again to play on your server together and let's see. As well, you told as you need a tank/support with you.
Post time 2021-2-3 02:52 AM | Show all posts
Magnum_bangbang replied at 2021-2-2 08:31 PM
Maybe, but Irithel can. Anyway it still not about damage only. All heroes have up-side and down-si ...

I say mage meta based on few mages who deal heavy damage like cecilion, change, vale, Luo yi, Alice

It doesn't involve all the mages

If you have a strategy with these mages, then it will be very effective
Post time 2021-2-3 05:18 PM | Show all posts
Edited by Magnum_bangbang at 2021-2-3 05:20 PM
Anand replied at 2021-2-3 02:52 AM
I say mage meta based on few mages who deal heavy damage like cecilion, change, vale, Luo yi, Alic ...

But man.

Cecilion like a MM. Bad untill 10 mins and 2 items. Best after 20 mins with full items. He woud OP. If averge game like 20-30 mins. But until averge game is 15 mins he isnt. And he woud OP, not because damage. Hes up-side is hes items. He can buy defence items without lose damage.

Change not deal big damage. She have 2 other up-side that make her strong.
1- She attacks on long distance while move. After all you just cant catch her. Her can kill you, but you never kill her.
2 - Her damage is percent damage. Like Claude you items and you health not matter for her. You can be a the most hardy tank, but she still like oneshoot you with he ultimate.

Its great up-side. But down-side is damage not be great. You can attack like only 1-2 players in teamfight and stay afk after it.

Vale - also great character after last buff. But he have one big down-side. He is 1 combo character. And any players with dash can easly evede this combo. After all, i am most time just dash to vale from hes ulty stun and just crush. Of this list, he is most overrated.

Alice - i cant tell about her. She unpopular one. And not only by my server. She has been picked on 0.5% of the games, according to world statistics. Avergy is 1%. Vale like 1.7%. I see her only few times after next. Maybe her is underrated, but more seems like you server anomaly.

Luo yi - I dont know a lot about her. Some time ago her be OP. Than, be nerfed. For now - i never see as her carry team. Low damage and bad defence. You can easy to kill her. Even easly than Layla. And uluckly Change she cant kill you. She have Up-side is strong early game, but i not see any reason to build strategy around her.
And one more note. I am know about one computer moba have character like it. And he is OP on pro team, because ulty, but weak on all others. Maybe Luo yi ulty is underrated. But its matter only if we told about full team games.

I not see any reason to build strategy around this characters.

After all characters as you show, have good Poke strategy potentual. Maybe this is problem? Poke strategy is good in current meta?
Post time 2021-2-3 09:37 PM | Show all posts
Magnum_bangbang replied at 2021-2-3 05:18 PM
But man.

Cecilion like a MM. Bad untill 10 mins and 2 items. Best after 20 mins with full items. H ...

If you don't know how to build a strategy with these mages, then you got a lot to learn about this game
Post time 2021-2-3 11:42 PM | Show all posts
Anand replied at 2021-2-3 09:37 PM
If you don't know how to build a strategy with these mages, then you got a lot to learn about this ...

Seems like I know it better than you. Also, I know how build more effective strategy without these mages. 

Anyway, if all as you told things without arguments like it, I haven't reason continue this dialogue. 

Comments

yes, there is no reason to continue this. You will learn as you keep playing  Post time 2021-2-4 02:58 AM
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